What's up with this website?

Gene-C · Post by **Gene-C** » Fri Nov 09, 2007 3:08 pm

Hi Mark/1856, That's just it, because there is no designated/specific area to verify actual membership information, it's difficult to tell what the current membership count actually is. I was told that the 10,000+ number represented both current and past members. The inside of the current newsletter, as I mentioned earlier, does also say that it is an "update", so I would take that as being the count of currently active members. Where did the current count of 500 come from? The continued silence from the "contingent of people who have stepped up to the task of taking over the responsibilities of the Manx Club in the very near future" is deafening, to say the least. I would imagine that members of this group participate regularly in events and cruise-ins at or near the "home office" of our club. Any update, no matter how basic and general, would be greatly appreciated.

L0084MC · Post by **L0084MC** » Fri Nov 09, 2007 4:51 pm

I will agree with the majority of you for the most part. What I can't agree with him on is the justification of the $30.00 a year membership. Here is how I justify mine, and I'm sure there are many out there in the same boat with me. People will spend 29.95 or more on one, two or three VW books. They can read them all from cover to cover and still not get the vast knowledge that has gathered on this site. The hands on step by step help that is there for the asking. Someone willing to walk you through a trouble spot as they have done for me on several occasions. The 420 friendly people that you meet on this website. And the enjoyment I get from just reading the post of the experienced. The post of the people that have been there and done that. $30.00. That's less that .09 cents a day. Not just 9 to 5 Monday through Friday, But 24/7 access to the people with the Know how and willing to share it. $30.00 It's worth it to me. The many, many, hours that Bruce and Winnie put in for the club. Do they deserve some kind of compensation for that. I would think that Bruce and Winnie might have something else in mind that they would like to spend there golden years doing. Yep! When you have as little Knowledge about VW's as I do, and count the value of the people I have met on this site $30.00 is a real bargen. That's just my Opinion.

Lee · Post by **Lee** » Fri Nov 09, 2007 9:31 pm

L0084MC, While it's true that a lot of valuable information has been given out on this site in the past, all of that information is also available in other parts of the Internet. There are several free sites dedicated to FG buggies, and several more for ACVWs in general. I don't know if there are any people who visit this site exclusively and never go to any other site for technical information, but if there are, they are severely limiting themselves. I didn't know a thing about VWs or even how to work on cars in general when I first started out in 1995 with a beater rail buggy. I discovered the RAMVA archive (which still has an answer to just about every question ever asked), and I eventually was able to gather enough information to get things working correctly. When I decided to get a FG buggy, the Manx Club's message board was THE place to be to meet people and get technical information. There was lots of activity and people were freely sharing information and helping each other get their buggies going. It was like a second Golden Age for buggies. Then the decision was made to make the Manx Club Board a pay site, and almost everyone left. The free sites now leave this board in the dust as far as participation goes. Again, I acknowledge that there are great people here, it's just that the same great people can be found in other places on the Internet, where they will help you all they can without charging $30 a year. Please don't get me wrong, I don't think $30 is too much for a year's worth of Club membership, especially when it costs almost twice that much to fill up my truck with gas! My point is that advice and technical information is vital in keeping our hobby alive. The more help that's out there, the more people will be willing to tackle the project of bringing an old VW back to life. The greatest thing about buggies (and ACVWs) is the way their owners are generally NOT elitist. All of the dune buggy and ACVW people I have met are more than willing to help other people, no strings attached. There are very few snobs in this crowd, and THAT's what sets us apart from every other type of car club. Back when I had a Karmann Ghia, I had the president of the Karmann Ghia Club of North America answering my questions (which were many!). Never once did he ask me to pay for his advice. Winnie tells us that changes are coming, and that our concerns will be addressed. That sounds good to me. The only thing that bothers me (and it REALLY bothers me!) is that the 'new management' refuses to show their faces. Perhaps they will once everything gets settled. We shall see.

Gene-C · Post by **Gene-C** » Fri Nov 09, 2007 9:36 pm

Please see Winnie's note to us all, it's the top Sticky on the Manx Club Forum homepage. I just sent a fax to the number listed on the Manx Club Contact page, personally thanking her for the update, and offering my support and assistance.

L0084MC · Post by **L0084MC** » Sat Nov 10, 2007 2:49 am

You are absolutely right Lee. There are plenty of other websites with the same information. I went to a couple of them one time when things were slowing down on this site and found some of the same people, and others there. One site I went to seem to be Banning good members for voicing their opinion or not going along with the program so to speak. Another one I went to, look to me like some of the members were at each others throat for voicing their opinion in disagreement, and others on that site could use some anger management (in my opinion). While others made it their daily post to stir the pot. All this in a club with less than 90 members at the time. Without trying to sound Detrimental, and with all due respect to you and the other clubs, If my memory serves me right, You were the peacemaker there and tried to defuse the situation. IN MY OPINION, if it had not been for you, that club would have folded by now. Bless the peace makers. Life is too short to waste it arguing, and everyone has the right to voice there opinion, agree or disagree. I may be a little green and a late comer to this site, but I don't think I have ever saw anything get out of hand here. I may be a little one sided with my opinion because this is the first club I found when I bought my First buggy. It's People and the administration on this site have always treated me with kindness and respect.

Lee · Post by **Lee** » Sat Nov 10, 2007 8:43 am

"Life is too short to waste it arguing" You got that right! We certainly have had our trials and tribulations. I think everyone has finally settled into the places they are the most comfortable with. With large groups comes large diversity. Things can go south with too many differing opinions. Having several groups to choose from helps us connect with the people who best match our own philosophy and ideas. I'm like you; the Manx Club was the first one that came to the rescue when I needed help. I feel we are all very lucky to have access to Bruce and all of his wisdom. The problems we have seen through the last couple of years have been depressing, but I feel that the fun we get from these little cars will persevere. After all, fun is what they are supposed to be all about!

L0084MC · Post by **L0084MC** » Sat Nov 10, 2007 12:39 pm

Lee This is the general discussion board for this site, where all voices and concerns should be discussed. I believe believe discussion is good for the site as long as anothers voice is respected. It clears the air. It cleans things up and brings concerns by a member front and center to be addressed and hopefully resolved. I also believe this post has done more for this club than anything I have seen in a while. Most everyone has voiced their concerns and disappointments. All done while being respectful to the others. I think This post of discussions will help this club grow. The icing on the cake was when Winny posted her information, which should have been done from the starting line. BUT I am glad she waited. It gave everyone a chance to vent their concerns and maybe brought some a little closer together. Now that it is out in the open, that puts the ball in their court. I am going to sit back and see which way they run with the ball and how they handle it. I am going to respect Winnie's request and see how it plays out. If taking a post of discussion apart and scattering it in several different places is any indication of things to come, I might have some real concerns. For now I will just watch.

rzeller · Post by **rzeller** » Mon Nov 12, 2007 2:20 am

L0084MC, I'd like to thank you for your post. I too started with this club and forum when I jumped into the buggy insanity. Like you, I think (for the majority of the posts) the knowledgeable people here interact with the less knowledgeable very politely and with a teacher's/coach's demeanor. I was never worried about being called names or feeling stupid for questions or requests for information. That isn't true on some of the other forums. I hope that comradery continues as we go forward. I think this is the right time for the new club board members to pay attention especially to the topics discussed in this thread. I think it was unfortunate that the thread was pulled apart and I hope that doesn't happen again (as I stated in an earlier post). I appreciate that Winnie did respond and provided some information, but I have some concern that too much time will pass without any updates. Even if the information is, "there isn't anything new to report". It would show willingness for inclusion. Lastly, I agree with you that if done with respect voicing opinions and concerns is healthy. This club is very unique in that it is worldwide. It is difficult for everyone to be included in events (especially when the core of the club is mainly on the west coast of the US), but it is extremely important that "every member" feel connected. That's a tough goal to achieve and I am anxious to see how the new club will handle that aspect. Thanks, Bud [QUOTE=L0084MC]Lee This is the general discussion board for this site, where all voices and concerns should be discussed. I believe believe discussion is good for the site as long as anothers voice is respected. It clears the air. It cleans things up and brings concerns by a member front and center to be addressed and hopefully resolved. I also believe this post has done more for this club than anything I have seen in a while. Most everyone has voiced their concerns and disappointments. All done while being respectful to the others. I think This post of discussions will help this club grow. The icing on the cake was when Winny posted her information, which should have been done from the starting line. BUT I am glad she waited. It gave everyone a chance to vent their concerns and maybe brought some a little closer together. Now that it is out in the open, that puts the ball in their court. I am going to sit back and see which way they run with the ball and how they handle it. I am going to respect Winnie's request and see how it plays out. If taking a post of discussion apart and scattering it in several different places is any indication of things to come, I might have some real concerns. For now I will just watch.[/QUOTE]

5150bossman · Post by **5150bossman** » Mon Nov 12, 2007 7:11 pm

For those with questions for the steering committee, go here. http://www.meyersmanx.com/forums/showthread.php?t=4665 P.S., I am not on the committee or have anything to do with the changes in the club. I am just putting this link up for those that are interested in voicing any opinions or concerns from this thread to those that are on the committee.

Gene-C · Post by **Gene-C** » Mon Nov 12, 2007 8:14 pm

In order to make sure that all future comments, questions, etc. about the transformation of the new Manx Club are addressed to the proper thread (see here: http://www.meyersmanx.com/forums/showthread.php?t=4665) I am going to lock this thread. I really appreciate everyone's responses (whether I personally agreed with them or not), and I hope that the "rebirth" of this club provides the foundation of which we all can be proud of. As I have said before, I do not know Bruce and Winnie personally, but that does not mean that I can not sense the love and respect shared by those that have interacted with them through the years. I hope that they too will look proudly and fondly on the evolution of this club as it treks into the future.